Primary School nightmare

janez

Capitulation accepted, even such deeply conditional. I respect your attempt to convince someone with immediate and ongoing experience, it was... brave. 

miss annie

@janez Just to satisfy my curiousity... Are you American by any chance?

janez

Errr... No. Why?

Siolae

@janez.  There was no capitulation.  It has nothing to do with courage.  There is no point in me wasting my time providing evidence in the face of such an utterly incoherent and illogical argument... to say nothing of the consistent poor spelling, grammar and sentence construction. 

dion

@janez - american spellings all the way thru

ChangN4N6

Through.

janez

<div>Chang, congrats on joining the grammar nazi's movement. </div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><img src="http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/2207a36a-4d33-4867-8ee4-ca8876c1a3e5.jpg"></div><div><br></div>

janez

Siolae, if you are giving up, give up.

janez

Still puzzled about Americanisms. <div><br></div><div>Anyway, amused and entertained with the community's reaction to real diversity. Not <i>Here is your Pad Thai ma'am</i> diversity, not <i>Uncle Tom</i> diversity. Diverse diversity. Reaction is I HOPE TO NEVER MEET YOU. </div>

andy

I don't think that's what it is at all. It seems more like a clash between people who look at education as consumers and people who look at it as citizens. The former attitude struggles to recognise that your choices shape the problem. The latter, at extremes, can give too much of a pass to failing institutions. There's also a model of discussion that confuses "having the last word" with "winning". That's just as tiresome online as it is in real life.

miss annie

Actually it wasn't the American spellings that made me ask, but I like the cat's spectacles.

sparkyley

I'm a mother of 4, two go to highgate woods, one Coleridge, baba still at home. I love coleridge, always a high standard of education. Am praying he gets into reception, but St aidens is my second choice as it's so small and fantastic also on list for the new ashmount. The problem for me was the lack of good- excellent secondary schools. So many good primary/ junior schools to choose from, and the rubbish quality of secondary schools! Kept my eldest out of secondary until we got her into Highgate woods. Didn't get in at first due to not being in catchment area. Highgate woods is good, not great. Did get offered iams and refused. Will apologise now for any spelling or gramma mistakes.....

Idoru

Cute cat pic, but in should have a lowercase i.<br>

Brodiej

Well i didn't click on this thread till now because i thought it would be boring. Very wrong...obviously a topic that a lot of people have strong opinions on. My 2 cents worth.... To anyone working/have worked in schools or heavily linked to the running of schools....it's acceptable for people to say things you don't like to hear. As far as i can see, you are living up to the stereotype of being a bit sensitive and patronising. People/parents will not always be on the same page as you, and believe it or not (as i've learnt over the years)....teachers are/were not always right. Janez has provided a lively discussion which has shown some valuable insight on both sides of the debate. You can dismiss or acknowledge those views (agreement doesn't have to exist), but i suspect there are many "Janez" in the area and their children will come of an age and a decision will have to be made about where they go to school. You can all blame the parental decision making processes and make comments about that based on your own beliefs, but she's just trying to do what she thinks is best for her children. Im sure everyone can empathise with that.

Ali

<P>Sparkyley,  What was the reaction from the authorities about refusing to send you kid to IAMS?  I thought it was ilegal to with hold kids fom education?</P> <P> </P> <P>How long did it take to get into the other school?</P>

RedSturgeon

@Ali - <a href="http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/parents/schoolslearninganddevelopment/choosingaschool/dg_4016124">Education's compulsory, school isn't</a>. I don't know anything about Sparkyley's situation, but in my limited experience it's actually very easy to tell your LEA you'll homeschool your kids (in fact it doesn't even from that web page seem you need to tell them), following which there's little oversight of what you're actually doing.<br>

janez

<div><div>@andy There is no consumers vs citizens controversy, because nothing indicates that people who left the area are bad citizens, poor school contributors or absent community builders<i> </i>in the areas they moved to.</div><div><br></div><div><div><div><div><div>The actual clash is between social engineering theory and human reality. Ordinary parents do not think long about their priority: is it their children's future or the benefits of the "I-hope-to-never-meet-you" community. It is like the migration question - fellow citizens' interests vs interests of people of the world. Of course, people who want to get into the country suffer from the citizens' choice not to let them in, but the citizens' interests are higher.</div></div></div></div></div><div><br></div><div>Slamming the door is not a winning tactics either. </div></div>

janez

<div>@Annie: I can not believe that I am introducing <a href="http://www.sadanduseless.com/2010/04/hipster-cat-the-best-of/">The Hipster Cat</a> to the hipsters' heartland. </div><div><br></div><div>If not the spelling, than what? Out of pure curiosity.</div>

janez

@Idoru, <a href="http://images.google.com/search?tbm=isch&hl=en&source=hp&biw=1440&bih=809&q=grammar+nazi&gbv=2&oq=grammar+&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=2033l3231l0l4524l8l8l0l0l0l0l100l625l7.1l8l0">which one</a> do you like more?

sparkyley

Ali- as redsturgeon said, I just homeschooled her. Told them this was what I was doing, asked lea if they had any curriculum manuals I had to follow to, they said no! The Internet provided most of her lessons. I also harassed harringey council every day to see where she was on the waiting list.

Sweetpea

<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">I’ve just seen this thread, I’m a lurker, who works part time at IAMS. I’m mainly retired now but have worked there since it opened in 1999. </span><span style="font-size: 10pt; "> </span><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">I realise that the discussion has moved on, but had to make a correction.</span><span style="font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p> <p class="MsoNormal">First of all, there is a glaring assumption in Ali’s contribution of Jan 25^th, he/she assumes that one of the boys arrested for allegedly carrying a weapon was from IAMS, whereas it is clear (from the Standard piece anyway) that he was one of those wearing red bandanas who had come from elsewhere to confront the IAMS pupils.<span style="font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p> <p class="MsoNormal">This might be a small point but it’s so easy to see how assumptions are made and gossip spreads like wildfire and a school’s reputation is tarnished.</p> <p class="MsoNormal">I was going to write a long piece about how the school has gone through changes in recent times, but I’m editing myself and will just say this. The school is changing from one that used to attract a lot of pupils from Hackney, because the Hackney schools were being closed and rebuilt. This is no longer the case. The younger pupils come from much closer to Islington ( and Haringey)  N4 and this trend will continue, which I think is a good thing, pupils will know eachother from primary, not see each other as “outsiders” and are more likely to feel a sense of community. This year there is a huge rebuilding programme and in September the lovely new buildings will open.<span style="font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p> <p class="MsoNormal">I don’t yet know what happened on that day last week, but I do know that the school has recently educated some very high achievers who have gone on to Russell Group universities, with strings of A*GCSEs, and the leading lady of Wuthering Heights for that matter, who came from a private school to finish her education there (a good few do since the recession bit). The Chair of Governors is a lawyer whose children went there and to Stroud Green.</p> <p class="MsoNormal">The children are lovely and there is a good atmosphere in the school, I walk around the corridors frequently and it always seems very calm in the classrooms to me.   The unavoidable building programme is making this year challenging for everyone but this will pass and will not affect future pupils who will enjoy all the benefits.  </p>

Ali

<P>Point taken sweetpea, but the measurable results say it is not getting great results.</P> <P>Are the Hackney kids now going to Skinners?</P>

Sweetpea

<P>I don't know about all of the Hackney kids , but the children from the Woodberry Down Estate who used to come to IAMS ( about 40 of them in one year group four years ago ), obviously now stay on at the school which is now an all through academy. As for the rest of Hackney, there are many more shiny new schools there to choose from now. </P> <P>My response to your  point about the results is this.  It all depends on your own child. If he or she is bright and motivated, they will do brilliantly at IAMS. I worked at the previous schools on that site as well  ( from 1979 onwards) and know of ex pupils who went on to Oxford and Cambridge and are now highflyers in medicine, finance, and many others fields, after  the Islington 6th form Centre, to which IAMS pupils have priority entrance.  I also know many other ex pupils who have successful non academic careers, have happy families. and make far more money than I do. This was all from a school whose official results were among the worst in London. </P> <P>The main point about the school is that it is very small, much smaller than more " successful" schools and the children are known by all the staff. They are not ignored when they drop out or go through a hard time, which I know to be the case in larger more high achieving local schools.  The Head of Year has to deal with about half the pupils, than in one of the large 240 pupil intake comps. The pastoral care is excellent and the opportunities in the Arts are very good and will get better. Yes, "we try harder". </P> <P>Some of the pupils who figure in the final results, have only been in the school for a relatively short time and have not had a full 5 years at the school. That doesn't show up in results.  That school has always had that demographic, and it knows how to boost the achievement of those pupils, as much as possible, it's always been one of their  strengths . </P> <P>Also, a lot of people choose it for their kids becasue they want them to have a short and easy journey. For them it's about safety and quality of life. The mainly middle-class kids I knew from the SG area that went there were not bullied because they were happy,confident and had a solid friendship group and participated in all the arts activities like Islington Youth theatre. . </P> <P>Having said that, a lot of kids go to IAMS who are the only pupil from their secondary school, and there is a residential right at the start of Year 7, so they can all make friends and feel confident from the start.</P> <P>My older daughter went to Highgate Wood, which is my nearest school,  and while it is great, and on a wonderful site, she didnt excel there because she felt overshadowed by friends who she felt ( and teachers believed) were brighter than her. Afterwards, she went to Islington 6th form by herself, which is where she really blossomed. She said the teaching there was better than at university. She went on to get a 2:1 from KCL in English which is more than some of her "brighter" school friends did.</P> <P>My point is that the higher achieving larger schools can sometimes 'lose' kids who are lacking in confidence in some ways.   Pastoral care and attention to the individual is incredibly important. </P>

checkski

An excellent post, Sweetpea. At last the record is put straight.

Brodiej

@ Sweetpea. Really helpful insight into a local school. Thanks very much.

Brodiej

@Checkski. There is no record, just more insight.

checkski

As you wish, Brodiej. People will judge for themselves. As far as I am concerned, this is record-straightening, after the sustained, vicious, ignorant rubbishing of earlier posters.

janez

Chekski, You are suggesting what people should think ("apparently, contempts welfare state" and other fantasies with offensive intent), and then call them vicious and ignorant for that. And your final argument is someone's poor grammar. It is cute, but can not be taken seriously.<div><br></div><div>However, the funniest bit is that <b>you are doing exactly what "people like us" do</b>, when they leave areas with diversity. Diversity means not only diversity of looks, but diversity of attitudes and values, and this is diversity you and "people like us" are not ready for. Diversity may well be absolutely relaxed about specificly British sacred cows - community obsession, class system and, of course, impeccable grammar. And your reaction to such diversity - "I hope to never meet you". Isn't it awesome?</div>

Ali

<P>I think what Sweetpea is saying is recognised in the Value Add measure which I mentioned above.</P> <P>Measured results are measured results you can't get away from that as most of life stages are based on choices that are based on results.  </P> <P>One concern I do have what if your kids are not "Arts & Media"  orientated and are say more scientific you don't have any local choice</P> <P>It sounds like that a some kids from IAMS eventually make it to a Russel Group Uni  at the other end of the  scale 65% do at schools in Muswell Hill do, it is back to the raw material. </P>

Idoru

" It all depends on your own child. If he or she is bright and motivated, they will do brilliantly at IAMS."<br><br>Quoted for truth. The secondary school I went to could only dream of having a 45% A-C GCSE result. In my year it was 24%, the year before was 13%. Last time I looked it had gone down to 13%. I went to the best university in the country for European philosophy - a subject I now have a Masters in. I have a very good job in journalism. I'm doing very well indeed. If kids are clever and motivated and have a good, supportive home life, they will do well.<br>