Previous old maps discussions on SG.org:
I may have to check out the photos at The Shaftesbury.
Here is a lovely painting of the original farmhouse in Stroud Green in 1820:
It just looks so rural and bucolic and quaint it's hard to imagine it's just by the traffic lights at the bottom of Crouch Hill. The shell of this building still exists, it's Stapleton Hall. Today it's hidden off Stapleton Hall Road and converted into flats, but back then it had a frontage and garden facing south west, towards the top of Stroud Green Lane. It was an old country house surrounded by gardens and open space, with a little drive in front, and probably facing out over a little village green.
To see this view in 1820, I think you would have to be standing roughly where 'five ways' traffic light is now, with the Larrik / Stapleton Tavern on your left, looking ahead. What you see now is the ugly triangle-shaped shop selling gearboxes (or whatever they are), on the angle in between Mount View Crescent and SH Road, Stapleton Hall is in behind.
It looks like there was once a little triangular green (the original Stroud Green?) in the area where the gear box shop is today, with the fence and the five barred gate and the farmhouse beyond. In the painting, there's a gate (firmly closed) at the end of the house at the right - that becomes Stapleton Hall Road when the road is built.
It all comes clear when you look at this map (just before 1870):
I found the picture in a book, don't know who painted it or why or where the original is. Probably done by one of the farmer's family to stick on the wall. Rather a charming scene I thought. Hope that helps.
That's wonderful KRS. Which book did you find it in?
"People and Places - Lost Estates in Highgate, Hornsey and Wood Green" (Hornsey Historical Society,1996). There's a chapter on Stapleton Hall by local chap Roy Hidson.
KRS, that is fantastic.
Best Old Stroud Green post I've seen. Which map is that that you've taken the detail from? I'd love to get a copy.
Yes I'd like to know that too. I'd be curious to see more of the map, especially to the east. historical sources that I have read make it clear that the owners of the Stapleton estate resisted development on their land until quite late. Thus Stapleton Hall Road and development to the north up to the Hogs Back ridge (Mount View Rd) being mostly 1880s (1890s and later north of the ridge in Hornsey Vale). But I've never been too clear on the area between Upper Tollington Park and Stapleton Hall Rd, where the building appears to be mainly 1870s like south of Upper Tollington. It therefore interests me that the above map shows development only on the Islington side of SGR.
@KRS - is it possible that the picture shows the view from what would become Stapleton Hall Rd, the view we get now? I know that the 'hall' has been rebuilt at various times, and much of it is now late victorian so it's hard to tell. But I note that in the vuiew above the largest structure has three windows per floor, whereas it now has four. I wonder whether the largest structure shown is a later addition now demolished (and subsequently replaced in the new development), and the surivivng hall is the structure that we have a gable-end view of in that picture.
There are more pictures of Stapleton Hall and maps, old Stroud Green photos etc on the info boards in the back of the White Lion. I also used to have a book that I got from the bookshop in Crouch End a few years ago. Can't remember the title, it may well be the same one KRS has, I'll see if I can dig it out. If I find it I'd be happy to lend it to you Arkady.
Arkady, all I can tell you is that the map is the 1870 map of the area - the official Ordnance Survey or official government map I believe.
I have a framed copy somewhere, but will be hard to find at present as it's been stored due to builders in the house.
Though published 1870, the survey must have been done a few years earlier. I know this because my house was built that year (1870) and it is not on the map. I have the original deeds. I live on the east side of Stroud Green Road. Incidentally that answers your query about the area between Upper Tollington Park and Stapleton Hall Road - you're right, about 1870.
I'll cut and paste some of the text from the book when I have time - the full story is in there.
Or ISBN 0 905794 17 6 if you can find it. Welcome to borrow my copy.
@Tallboy - similar yes, except it now has four windows per floor not three.
@KRS - thanks for that. I might take a trip to the Hornsey Historical society and find myself a copy!
You can buy the 1870 map (as well as the 1894 and 1912 versions) from Alan Godfrey
Do u have to be a member of the Historical Society to go there ? Chang
You can buy copies of old maps from Islington Local History Centre in Finsbury Library. There's a pdf about them on this page
The painting is in the Bruce Castle, Tottenham, collection.
Older maps of the area can be found by a careful rummage through the MOTCO website: http://motco.com/
See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Map-_Stroud_Green,_London_1786.jpg
Funny on that old map Hornsey Road was known as Devil's Road....spooky there now sometimes...,have u seen da woman in black? Chang
One of our W.I. members is the manager of Bruce Castle museum, she gave us the most fabulously interesting talk about it's history and the collection.
Chang, nope, no need to be a member, just wander in and you can have a browse of the Hornsey Historical Society books and there's a whole row of old maps. I did the other day. Corner of Rokesly Avenue and Tottenham Lane, just up and over Ferme Park Road.Website says: 'normally open for sales and enquiries on Thursdays and Fridays from10 am to 2 pm, and on Saturdays from 10.30 am to 4.30 pm.'
Wonder who lived in "Devil's House" which looks to be on the corner of Hornsey and Hanley Roads.
Somebody De Ville. There's something about in the Victoria History. I seem to recall that the name was later incorrectly conflated with that of a famous highwayman.
Wrote about it here:
KRS, great map, thanks.
Thanks Reg, that's fascinating. Is that Mr Trinder as in Trinder Road, I wonder?
Thanks all that's fascinating. Great blog Mirandola!
Who was mr corbyn? Not the mp's family...?
Here are some photos I took of the pictures in the Shaftesbury:http://www.flickr.com/photos/67014684@N05/6775167680/in/photostream/.
For map-lovers, here's a presentation of maps of the Stroud Green/Crouch Hill area showing its 19th century development. I love the fact that the Stroud Green Station bridge seen above (and the one over Upper Tollington Park) were built before the roads that later ran under them. They gave access to fields that would otherwise have been cut off.
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