Is this now the grooviest bit of Stroud Green?

Apparently, this is where you can almost touch the trendy in Stroud Green now....

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  • I was sat having some wine there the other day and, tbf, it was all pretty enjoyable
  • Yeah, sitting outside Bacchus is great, and rather reinforces the impression that it should be pedestrianised.
  • I'm for pedestrianising large swathes of our Urban landscape - this is a great contender!
  • Oh come on, a pedestrianised piazza? That's a bit of a rosy-tinted stretch!

    Immediately to the left of the photo you often have a down-and-out or three just around the corner, sitting on either side of the walkway and sipping their Tennent's; Turn left past the coffee shop at the far end in this picture to see where drug-dealers and skunk smokers congregate in the evening. Not exactly civilised European café culture, is it? I'd rather have an airport or four-lane motorway there than encourage that lot!

    Bacchus is in a poor location, particularly that end-unit where for many years one business has failed after another. I've had a glass or two inside, where it's pretty bare, but I wouldn't hazard sitting outside, imagining the risk of a run-by phone or bag theft on foot or bike.

    Still, I'd love to see Bacchus thrive (and redecorate!), and the "piazza" (give me strength!) become pedestrianised and salubrious (i.e., free of sociopaths). I just can't see it happening with our current demographics.
  • Well the issue there is non-policing of toe-rags, rather than making an effort to nicen the area?

    I often feel that if we're given and use nice areas, then the undesirable elements you note, won't hang out there. If decent people vacate the space and don't bother to use them then obviously that happens.

    I feel there's a few crappy bits of Stroud green that bring the whole area down - Tesco should make an effort to green the area in front of their shop and the two car washes should be closed down immediately. Then the local community can use the space like they use the rest of it!
  • I often sit outside at Bacchus in the evening and haven't seen any of the antisocial behaviour mentioned (though have seen street-drinkers in the day). Not saying it doesn't happen, but it's not a constant problem. The stripped-back decor is also rather on-trend isn't it? I can't think of a new place that isn't done out that way, more or less (less is more!).
  • Also, interventions to improve public spaces generally have the opposite effect to the one Scruffy mentions. If you make it a popular place for people to congregate there will be more eyes on the street and less antisocial behaviour will follow. There's a whole science behind streetscraping and public space provision.
  • So "the two car washes should be closed down immediately" because what? Because they're not all "nice" like another wine bar or hipster cafe? Because you might get your feet wet while walking past?

    That Big Yellow one has been there as long as I can remember, and is always busy, so looks to me like a successful business... Why would the proprietor want to close it down?
  • @fwiw I haven't passed the car wash just up from Wells Terrace on Stroud Green Road in recent weeks, but in the past, if they were busy, they'd park cars partially out of their doorways on the public pavement, forcing pedestrians to walk in the cycle lane. They were warned about this by Islington Council a couple of years ago, but it made no difference. When they closed for the day, they'd leave all their wet litter scattered on the pavement outside both the entrance and exit, doing their bit to add to the shit-hole ambience of Stroud Green Road. I doubt this has changed recently. Not a business owner that cares about the local area or who deserves any consideration from the public. I'd be relieved to see that car wash closed down.
  • Nah, both of them are a mess, even growing up in the grimiest part of Hounslow the car washes weren't that shite and run down as these ones.

    The owners and workers make no effort to clean the pavement (with dirt and pollution they are putting onto it and into the gutters), repair any of the broken down boarding or stop their customers parking on the pavement.

    Just so some lease-car drug dealers can get their whip in shape? They just need to rebuild the lot so it doesn't look so shoddy - they should be embarassed to run businesses like that. Coupled with the billboards opposite, the bottom car-wash really brings down the rest of the road. The car wash and garage next to Nandos are a mess and a nuisance as well.

    I think we're too used to everything being run down, I think you don't realise. I'm not a fucking hipster but I just want to live in a nice area where the whole community can be proud to live in.
  • But where would the lease-car drug dealers launder the readies if you shut the car washes down?
  • I'd be happy if they send funds to me at POBOX 'grumpy but dry footed keyboard warrior'
  • I'd always considered the slightly haphazard feel of Stroud Green Road (the "shit-hole ambience?") to be part of its appeal, but I do agree that cars blocking pavements and cycle lanes and so on isn't ideal. I suppose I'm just used to it.
  • I shouldn't post in the morning in meetings, sorry If I was too ragey! I'm a great believer in urban environments influencing behaviour and I think if stuff is too run down, people feel less happy and are more likely to be aggressive and degrade the environment even more (i.e. dump and piss everywhere); I don't know if people share that idea, but if the road was more looked after people would enjoy it more - I'm talking about everybody in the community not just yummy mummies and hipsters.
  • I regularly shout at people who drop litter or piss on my road - not sure it's a great deterrent but i've always felt that if the 99% of people who are offended bollocked the 1% who offend, it might do something? One can hope.

    Here's some catnip for angry posters/north london liberal hipsters, I blame a decade of tory cuts - ask one of the two policemen who look after stroud green what affects them most, its lack of resources - and that lack of resource creates an environment where anti-social behaviour festers.
  • Since having a baby (and pram) that carwash on SGR is a right pain in the arse. Sometimes I've got to push it up the road instead of the pavement or bike lane.

    Likewise my mate who is in a wheelchair had to just wait for a car to be washed before he could get by.
  • Chelsea is nice, Kensington is nice. Still inhabited by a great deal of aggressive arseholes. The only difference is that the streets are swept more frequently and they pay a lot more council tax.
  • The "only" difference???
  • I love Stroud Green. I like the fact that down and outers get to remind those of us who are a million times more fortunate what a mixed world we inhabit. I hope the hideous tube development doesn't make SG an upscale watering hole for the privileged. We're all 'decent' people; some of us are just better washed and dressed than others.
  • “We're all 'decent' people”—I did wonder how it was that we live in such a gorgeous Utopia; even the knife-wielding thugs and sociopathic architects are decent. Good job we have so many “down and outers”. We ought keep a minimum ratio of the population down (bless ‘em) and visible as a warning to the rest of us about what happens if we step out of line.
  • That's some rose tinted vision right there, a bit naive I'm sorry.

    Of course there are decent people from all walks of life and it's got nothing to do with being better washed or clothed, the thing is not everyone is good or decent, including some of the down and outers.

    Maybe I need to get out more, but I've never been mugged, assaulted or intimidated by middle-class 40 somethings.

    Next time someone defecates in front of me on the sidewalk, I'll remind myself that I'm so fortunate I don't live in an upscale neighbourhood. Next time I have to fetch my girlfriend from the station after a late shift, I'll remind myself that the drug dealers and takers are just decent people and there's nothing to worry about, she can make her own way back through the park in the dark?

    Comon, I'm not asking for Chelsea, I'm asking for a safe clean neighbourhood that ALL OF US can enjoy in safety.
  • You have much more chance of someone actually coming to your rescue if something did occur round here then in somewhere like Chelsea in my opinion.

    If you have never been mugged by middle-class 40 somethings can you tell me the name of your bank please?
  • Hmmm. Well, Fox, if opinion is all one needs to back up a statement, it’s my opinion that in the first place you’re far more likely to be mugged around here than in Chelsea, to the extent that you’re still (in MY opinion) much safer in Chelsea, even if there are no potential rescuers around.
  • Asking for a safe and clean neighborhood is putting the bar too high now? If the development at the FP station helps the area I am all for it.
  • Do people actually feel unsafe though?
  • Yes around the station if you happen to come home late.Yes in the park at night as well.
  • I don't usually feel unsafe because I'm a man, although I find areas of SG increasingly unpleasant. However, my 70-year-old mother won't walk under the bridge at night, and I can't blame her. I would not go into the park at night.

    I agree with this:
    "I'm a great believer in urban environments influencing behaviour and I think if stuff is too run down, people feel less happy and are more likely to be aggressive and degrade the environment even more (i.e. dump and piss everywhere); I don't know if people share that idea, but if the road was more looked after people would enjoy it more - I'm talking about everybody in the community not just yummy mummies and hipsters. "

    and this

    "I blame a decade of tory cuts - ask one of the two policemen who look after stroud green what affects them most, its lack of resources - and that lack of resource creates an environment where anti-social behaviour festers."
  • edited September 3
    Yeh, I don't feel unsafe as I'm young and lived in London my whole life, my girlfriend on the otherhand asks me to pick her up every evening from Finsbo Station (which I'm happy to do) but it could be avoided if that specific area wasn't as run down and full of dealers and addicts. I'm sure 99% of time it's fine, but that 1%... there have been too many stabbings and muggings recently as well as sadly some sexual assaults and murders that it's not worth the risk.

    I would definitely encourage you to message your local councillors and MPs with your concerns, doesn't need to be a long message, but you can easily do this on https://www.writetothem.com/ if you don't have your local councillors addresses. However around the Bridge, the councillors in neighbouring wards are:

    Asima Shaikh, Gary Heather, Mick O'Sullivan, Eldridge Culverwell, Kirsten Hearn, Daniel Stone, Ibrahim Emine. I think that covers it.

    I'm sorry therattle, that SG is getting increasingly unpleasant, is there anything specific you're referring to?
  • edited September 3
    I think it's ok, let's not be too extreme. I mean obviously things could be improved but it's a big city... It is still a very nice and dynamic area compare to many. I think the cut in the social help few yars ago, didn't help, but I think there also something to do with the city of London expending. Finsbury Park, which used to be considered suburb is slowly becoming part of central London. The Area will become more dynamic, but is also getting more populated and station is getting busier...
  • Hi Luke. Nothing particularly different to that already mentioned/moaned about here.
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